berlingo wipers stopped, fuse keeps blowing. BSi?

[filobiz]

hi people looking for some help here.
my wipers have packed up completely. the fuse keeps blowing (F17 under the bonnet) - the guy at the garage says it's a problem with the bsi and it would need replacing at a HUGE cost (i'm in australia). i have found one pretty cheap but now a differnet guy says it's not the bsi where the problem is, it's the BSM! what do i need to do? do i replace and reprogram the bsi or do i need to replace / fix the BSM? can the bsm be fixed? will a new bsi unit fix the blowing fuse and ultimately fix the wipers? when i turn wipers on, there is a 'tick' noise comes from the bsm... can anybody shed some light on this before i go insane!

thanks for your help

bill in sydney (aka filo)

it's mk2 2004 (thanks blueblingo)

[BlueBlingo]

It would help if you can provide your vehicles specifications / Year build etc

---

Assuming yours is a Mk2 Fuse F17 is rated at 30 Amp.

If you are getting a "Tick" noise from the BSM when the wipers are turned on I would assume the wiper relay in the BSM is operating, what I suspect is you have a problem with the wiper motor windings gone down to earth/ shorted or motor or linkage is seized.
I the past I have had a rear wiper motor give similar symtoms to yours on a Fiat Punto I stripped the motor down cleaned lubricated the wiper arm shaft reassembled and it was fine.

[filobiz]

cheers
...and that would explain the blowing fuse?

[BlueBlingo]

cheers
...and that would explain the blowing fuse?

First thing to do is disconnect wiper motor then check wiring loom to wiper motor to make sure it has not chaffed causing shorts to earth.
Then try operating wipers whilst motor is disconnected.
If F17 does not blow you know problem is wiper motor or linkage related as previously stated.

[filobiz]

thanks v much BB. went back to see the guy and he said he'd disconnected the motor and the fuse was still blowing. we've since put a brand new comm2000 in so he will try once more, but otherwise i think i've given up (for now) and he will re-wire it and put a switch on the dash for the wipers. rain forecast this week and i need to drive for work! when / if i have more time i will try and fix it properly (replace the BSM?) - i won't let this beat me! thanks for your help and your input, much appreciated.
if you have anymore thoughts please let me know.

cheers

bill

[BlueBlingo]

Hi

Attached is front wiper wiring diagram for my M59 2.0Hdi 2003
Wipers operate somewhere along these lines

Battery Positive marked with red cross supply’s a permanent battery positive thru Fuse F17 to the normally open contact on the right hand relay marked with red line.

When first position is selected on wiper stalk com 2000 sends a digital signal via wires 9012A & 9013A to the BSI unit
( This is the Vehicle Area Network "VAN" Data Bus)

The BSI Recognises this signal and sends a positive supply via wire 5265 to the BSM -This is the front windscreen wiper relay output.
This output energises the relay thus closing the contact, battery positive (Indicated by the red dotted lines then feeds to the other relay(Slow /Full Speed Relay) which is unenergised.Battery positive therefore flows along the wire 500(Marked purple to the front wiper motor item 5015 ) Pin 4 this is the "Low Speed Motor Command"
Earth (Battery negative) to the motor is indicated by the green line terminating at earth point MC20 on the Front RHS of the Vehicle The earth wire is m5015 Pin 1 at the Motor Connector. The motor will operate at slow speed with a delay between wipes (relay looses/regains/looses supply)
When the wiper stalk is moved to the second speed Comm 2000 transmits a digital signal on the VAN network to correspond to the stalk position request wipers still operate at slow speed but the delay between wipes is reduced (Relay energised more frequently)
When the wiper stalk is moved to the fast wipe position.Com 2000 transmits a digital signal to correspond to this on the VAN Network to the BSI, the BSI then transmits a digital signal via wires 9012 & 9013 to the BSM unit which in turn recognises this as a request to Energise the Slow / Full speed relay the contact changes over the "Low speed Motor Command" is lost. Battery Positive then follows wire 501 Marked Yellow to pin 5 at the motor Connecter, This is the "High Speed Motor Command"
Relay
Wire 503 (pin 2) is the Engine Fixed stop command. From the BSI- Looking at the diagram / switch arrangement I think this ensures the wipers return to home when wipers are switched off and should give a reading around battery positive voltage.

So if your repairer has disconnected the wiper motor at the plug connection wires 500 & 501 should have no load on them to blow fuse F17. unless the wires are shorting to earth or one of the relays has literally disintegrated internally.
Ask your repairer to try removing wires 500 & 501 from plug 16V at the BSM then see if the fuse blows when wipers operated.
Also check wire 503 between motor & BSI.

[filobiz]

amazingly nice fo you BB to go to all this trouble! i wish you lived in bondi!! this arrived just too late as i'd bitten the bullet and got the guy to put a switch on the dashboard, which he's done now. 5 days of rain forecast in sydney so i had no choice. anyway i showed him your last post and he nodded and said "yep, yep, did that" - he is sure it is some problem in the BSM.
so next question is do i try and fix the bsm? BBA-reman? (you know them?) or get a new one, which would then have to be reprogrammed etc etc. my new bsi unit arrives this week, but bloke reckons it's not the bsi it's the bsm. so anyone reading this in australia, i have a brand new bsi unit for sale!! (i might as well hold on to it though coz something's bound to go wrong). so anyway thanks a million for all your help BB really really grateful. my wipers are now working but i'm not happy! spanking new comm2000 with a totally redundant right arm!!
cheers for now
bill

[pk7478]

Filobiz. Tell to your Citroen mechanic to read InfoDIAGS concerning replacement of BSI and BSM and diagnostics of electric equipment in PSA cars. If your mechanic don't know what is it - find other mechanic.
Replacement of expensive units - it's not a diagnostics. It's a rubbery.

[Ol'Jeffers]

You could also ensure that this procedure is carried out if the battery has been disconnected:
http://www.petercoopercarrepairs.co.uk/p...cedure.htm

Reconditioned BSIs may be obtained from this (worldwide) company:
http://www.bba-reman.com

They have a branch in Rochester, Kent Tel: 01634 687222

They also trade on eBay for some parts. All of their parts are guaranteed for two years.

EDIT: Damn!! Their website is down at the mo.!

[BlueBlingo]

amazingly nice fo you BB to go to all this trouble! i wish you lived in bondi!! this arrived just too late as i'd bitten the bullet and got the guy to put a switch on the dashboard, which he's done now. 5 days of rain forecast in sydney so i had no choice. anyway i showed him your last post and he nodded and said "yep, yep, did that" - he is sure it is some problem in the BSM.
so next question is do i try and fix the bsm? BBA-reman? (you know them?) or get a new one, which would then have to be reprogrammed etc etc. my new bsi unit arrives this week, but bloke reckons it's not the bsi it's the bsm. so anyone reading this in australia, i have a brand new bsi unit for sale!! (i might as well hold on to it though coz something's bound to go wrong). so anyway thanks a million for all your help BB really really grateful. my wipers are now working but i'm not happy! spanking new comm2000 with a totally redundant right arm!!
cheers for now
bill

I am not supprised that you aint happy and to be honest having read your post`s I have no faith in your mechanic whatsoever.

I am still convinced that the problem is in the loom ( Wire 500 and/or wire 501 )between the BSM & the wiper motor.
from what you have stated it sounds as if he has just disconnected the wiper motor plug connection at the motor, tried the wipers and the fuse has blown and assumed its the BSM.

He must disconnect the wires 500/501 at the plug connection at the BSM operate the wipers and see if the fuse blows,If it does its more than likely BSM.If the fuse does not blow it indicates a loom fault

I would consult another mechanic who is competent in the use of Lexia 3 Diagnostics / Car electrics prior to having the BSM removed for repair.

Have you a Multimeter, if you want I can post some pictures on testing your fault with a Multimeter but it have will be this weekend. It should be fairly cheap for you to buy a Multimeter from one of your electronics stores/outlets.