First PSA-car: Berlingo or Partner?

[Shitblast]

Hi, guys. I'm a 37 years old physician from Norway. I been running Golfs and Caddys up to this point. I fix most problems myself, apart from bigger parts, as I have no garage, and things with many bolts on them are difficult work on in this salty country. I'm considering a Berlingo or a Partner. Is it correct, though, what wikipedia says; that Berlingos and Partners are the same? Is the quality also equal?

[3rensho]

Hello Shitblast (are you a proctologist ;-)) and welcome. True, they come off the same assembly line. Only difference is badge, model names and bell and whistle combinations. Be aware that Peugeot has a replacement model for the Partner coming out.called a Rifter. https://www.berlingoforum.com/thread-166...ht=peugeot.

[Shitblast]

, no, it's from my experience as a med-student. One sometimes gets to see real s**t fly, no matter the specialty. I'm a GP. Well, that was a quick, precise answer. Might be worth getting the Berlingo for that reason alone. Ok, they come off the same lines. Do they hold up equally too? As for for the model year: I only want the bare running essentials in a car. The less things to break and fix; especiallly electronics, the better, so I guess that would be a pre-2008 one.

[Gadgetman]

If you want the absolute least of electronics to elf you up, you need to go Pre-BSI, which means pre-2000 models.
The BSI is a lump of electronics and circuit boards poorly protected from rainwater hidden under the dash.

On my 1999 1.4i I've swapped the engine... The catalysator, the rear axle(reconditioned, found on finn.no), partially rebuilt the engine(replaced two cylinder liners, piston rings, and so on), replaced the clutch, rebuilt the rear brakes...

The rear brakes on the M49 and M59 versions is kind of pants, really, unless you're lucky enough to score a rare M59 with rear disc brakes...

If you need to get around on the horrendously difficult Oslo winter roads(we in the rest of the country tend to giggle at the news when everything in Oslo comes to a screeching or crashing halt as soon as there's a few snowflakes on the road) you may want to look for one of the Partners used by the Post. Some of those had the 4WD conversion done to them. (4WD isn't a factory option. They were rebuilt by a company in Netherland I think, before the Norwegian distributor took them in. )

The 5seater is a bad idea if combined with the 1.4i and areas of extreme cold. In -20 it turns into an ice box on wheels unless you drive it on a low gear all the time. I assume the same applies to the 1.9D engine.

The Webasto fabric sun roof on some models is nice, but failure rates are slightly higher than Russian athletes at a drug test...

Sliding doors... Yes!
But check the metal below, all the way down to the weld underneath. Replacing the panel will cost 12 - 15K NOK. If you're lucky.

On the 1.4i, there's a small tube going from the head cover to the air filter housing(on some models at least, the ones with a 'diamond' cross section), and there the fitting connecting the tube and housing tends to break. This is a 'fix it or we'll ground you' issue(pollution) on the PPK (MOT in the UK). And it can't just be glued together because it's a special plastic. (I drilled small holes, 'sewed it together' with string, then used 2part epoxy)

There's two editions of the Haynes service manual for this car. Get the 2010 edition.

[Gravity]

Late last year I bought the (then) new B9 Berlingo.
A few weeks ago I added the previous model to it - the M59.

The B9 is smoother, roomier, quieter and faster, but in my humble view the earlier M59 is a far better built machine. It also feels easier to work on, with a less cluttered engine bay, and the electronics are a tad simpler.

Gravity

[Shitblast]

@Gadgedman Well, that was some condensed, nice information. I don't mind the cold, as long as the car starts. No, the 1.9 didn't get hot on short city-trips, and barely at all, after the thermostat went out a couple of weeks ago. I was planning to junk it at the end of May, but it likely has a CPS-failure. The CPS will shut down the entire engine on a Caddy. The CPS on the VW ALH is hard to get at, and the bolt holding it looks rusted. It likely cannot be heated, as the sensor itself is plastic. I'll have to do the job outside in the snow as well.

I'll be able to tolerate public transportation for a week or two. If a nice pre-2000 one pops up before that, I'll take it. Otherwise, I'll take my chances with the M59. Thinking to spend around 30000 NOK/£ 2800 on it.

Gravity: Easier to work on sounds nice. Is the M59 ok to work on, in general?

[Gadgetman]

I did all my work in a SMALL garage, that is, 2 foot wider and not much longer, either...

Any pre-2000 that costs 30k is way overpriced.
I gave 25K for mine about 5 years ago, and yeah, that was probably a bit more than I should have paid.

B49 and B59 are mostly identical. The biggest difference is the headlights...

The 1.4i got a small update during the transition(automatic belt tensioner on the timing belt) which is pretty nice. So if that is your choice of engine, you probably want that one.

The oldest cars (1998 and older) doesn't have the rear sliding door. They're strictly 3door models. Those are NOT a good idea if you have family.
The sliding door is a wonder in narrow parking spaces, and when handling child car seats.

The Berlingo is in the same size class as the Caddy, but thanks to the passive RW steering, it does corners a lot more sporty. (I drive a reasonably new VW Caddy 1.6TD with DSG automatic gearbox at work. I hate it... Particularly the DSG... )

Note that any M49/M59 that has had the rear axle replaced with a recon unit that has grease nipples added is worth more than a stock model.
(The grease helps prolong the life of the needle bearings at the end of the arms)
A replacement rear axle will set you back about 5500NOK(you get about 800NOK back if you return a broken one if it's the needle bearings that has broken. Id the torque rods break, though... nothing)
But you'll also need new wheel hubs(The bearings falls apart when you pull the hubs off, and they're not sold separately), shocks, and probably some rubber blocks.
All in all, with necessary tools if you don't have it all, it can cost up to 10K,

A quick tip if you can get to do it is to lift the rear end of the car off the ground, using the jackpoints along the side of the car.
Then look at the rear mounts of the rear axle. If it separates from the frame, the rubbers are gone and must be replaced soonest. (from 150 - 600NOK each depending on where you buy them) This is a problem that is only visible for those who know how to look for it.

There's a Brake power adjuster next to the righthand rear wheel. It's a metal block with loads of brake pipes entering, and a lever connected to a long spring that goes to the moving arm on the suspension on that side.
The spring may be broken, and the arm can have seized. This is usually overlooked at the PKK (MOT) because the spring is almost completely hidden.
It's a reasonably easy fix, and the spring is cheap on ebay, so it's a good bargaining point.
(It doesn't make much if any difference to the driving experience during normal conditions, so people never notice it)
The arm can be freed with a bit of persuation with a hammer...

The horn may be failed. It's kind of exposed to the weather in the front...
If so, it can be quite fiddly to replace, if you do it correctly. cutting the wire and mounting a new one in the engine compartment is kind of unprofessional, but well... there's usually enough room.

[Gravity]

£2800 for an M59?
Cars must be very expensive where you live!
For that money you can buy the later B9 in the UK.

The M59 I've recently bought is 2008, 1.6hdi Multispace with Modutop and cost me £999. Actually it cost £1000, but I found a £1 coin under the seat when I got it home!

The small jobs I've done on it so far have been straightforward. Egr removal next, then handbrake adjustment, gearbox oil change, then replace heater matrix. As the weather improves I will tackle these. Then I'll know!

Gravity

[geoff]

The M59 is V Good and simple to work on with inexpensive components,naturally computerised stuff needs a garage. I will say that no diesel likes to run warm /provide a good heater unlike a petrol.

[Shitblast]

@Gadgetman Yea, I'll continue running simple diesel engines for as long as possible. I didn't know about the axle paddings, but understood it through this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4T7YqwRjUg. I will jack it if I have the chance :-). I like practical horn fixes.

Gravity: Yes, they are. There are more taxes on cars and driving than i care to remember.  Lately, the cost of parking was quintupled to £ 16 to park for an hour, and they're filling in the parking spots with large flower containers. I just pay and try to forget. If one wants to get rich in Oslo, one should sell car parts. Consumption and sales aren't matched at all. Good luck on the repairs.

Geoff: Cheap parts are a plus.

Edit: Gadgetman: I actually prefer the leaf springs of the Caddy going over the sometimes numerous speed bumps in western Oslo. Some of them made my golfs bottom out at 20 kph. I used to drive the E-134 across the country, but now it's only the city or multiple lanes highway.

And regarding the rear bearings: Can't one just change them?