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Big miles on an auto!??
#1
Ok I've spent some time searching through previous posts. And I've seen all the scare stories on other websites. Nevertheless, I've just taken a second hand Automatic (EGS6) Berlingo Multispace XTR for a test drive. It was 2 years old with only 10000 miles on it and it drove fantastically well and I'm really interested in buying it. I already have a Berlingo which has now done 162000 miles completely trouble free apart from the usual servicing, consumables and cambelt change. It's even on the original clutch! Setting aside everyone's preferences for the driving style of this automatic, are there any members who have done big miles over a few years with this gearbox? Maybe I'm just lucky or maybe I'm mechanically sympathetic but I would like to think I could get some serious trouble free miles with this automatic as well? Any thoughts?
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#2
Well, I've had my VTR 1.6 airdream auto from new in May 2014, done 32K miles, and it hasn't given me any problems. Give yourself some time to get used to the auto, such as easing off the gas a touch when it sounds ready to change up, and you'll be surprised how fast and smooth it is.
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#3
(21-10-2018, 09:32 PM)rnamman Wrote:  Well, I've had my VTR 1.6 airdream auto from new in May 2014, done 32K miles, and it hasn't given me any problems. Give yourself some time to get used to the auto, such as easing off the gas a touch when it sounds ready to change up, and you'll be surprised how fast and smooth it is.

Thanks. I was happy with the driving experience. I'm just worried that it wouldn't be as reliable as in used to with the extra stuff to go wrong. I've spent a lot of time googling the EGS6 gearbox and there seemed to be a lot of bad feedback about reliability. Especially on the French car forum. Although I know the nature of the internet means people spend more time and effort complaining than praising things so it can cloud your opinion. And a lot of the bad stuff was one particular car/owner. I was starting to worry that no one on here had done normal/big milage over a few years with the automatic. A lot of views of this post but no replies.. Until you did, so Thanks. I'm going to talk to the local independent garage who services my car today to see if they have the kit needed to service or repair a egs gearbox.
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#4
Problem is that it's not really an 'automatic', it's an 'automated manual transmission'. These things are quite reliable on trucks and buses, where the components can be made bigger. But none of them are that good on cars, even VW groups DSG isn't as reliable as conventional torque converter automatics.

Basically you have two manual gearboxes, one does the odd number gears and one does the even numbers, each one has a clutch and they alternate between the two. The biggest failures on them are the two clutches, like a manual gearbox the clutches are consumable items and you have to expect them to fail at some point. They don't tend to last as long as a normal clutch and you get a really massive repair bill when they fail. Have a look at the number of auto and semi auto citroens and Peugeots on ebay as spares or repair, once the car is more than a few years old they can write the car off. 32k isn't really 'big miles'.

When AMT's are working they give exceptionally smooth gear changes and superb fuel economy.
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#5
(22-10-2018, 06:34 AM)hawaiianblue Wrote:  Problem is that it's not really an 'automatic', it's an 'automated manual transmission'. These things are quite reliable on trucks and buses, where the components can be made bigger. But none of them are that good on cars, even VW groups DSG isn't as reliable as conventional torque converter automatics.

Basically you have two manual gearboxes, one does the odd number gears and one does the even numbers, each one has a clutch and they alternate between the two. The biggest failures on them are the two clutches, like a manual gearbox the clutches are consumable items and you have to expect them to fail at some point. They don't tend to last as long as a normal clutch and you get a really massive repair bill when they fail. Have a look at the number of auto and semi auto citroens and Peugeots on ebay as spares or repair, once the car is more than a few years old they can write the car off. 32k isn't really 'big miles'.

When AMT's are working they give exceptionally smooth gear changes and superb fuel economy.
I'm aware that is an automated manual and I know about the twin clutch systems used by manufactures like VW. The unit on the Citroen is only a single clutch and gearbox though as far as I know. Literally a normal Citroen manual gearbox and single (DMF) clutch which is operated by a electro hydraulic actuator instead of a clutch pedal and servo. I do take your point that the clutch might wear out a bit sooner on the automated system, but how early? I'd be happy if it lasted 3/4 as long as the one in my current car. I'll have a look on ebay though as you said.
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#6
hawaiianbloke Wrote:Have a look at the number of auto and semi auto citroens and Peugeots on ebay as spares or repair,

Well I tried "Berlingo automatic runner or spares" in the search and it came up with the grand total of none Big Grin
So where does this bit go then ?
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#7
(22-10-2018, 07:44 AM)ffrenchie Wrote:  
hawaiianbloke Wrote:Have a look at the number of auto and semi auto citroens and Peugeots on ebay as spares or repair,

Well I tried "Berlingo automatic runner or spares" in the search and it came up with the grand total of none Big Grin

Just had a look myself. So far I can't find any. Plenty of traditional manual gearbox citroens for sale though spares or repair. Main issues seen to be injectors and fuel system.
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#8
Just been looking more closely at eBay. 3 automatic citroens for spares or repair. 2008,2009,2009 grand Picasso's. 1 mentions gearbox. 1 just mentions that the engine is broken. Also a dubious looking 2007 high milage C4 but no definite mention on gearbox. All fairly old cars though. Still no wiser as to real world reliability of the esg6 really.
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#9
From what i have seen on here and read elsewhere the EGS do suffer from premature clutch wear in most cases. Maybe most are worn by 50k but that is not the whole picture, the actuator can pack up and then you are into a grand + to get it fixed.

As mentioned earlier in this thread they do work better in the trucks but i do know a lot of drivers hate them. They are fine for trunking up and down the motorway but any off road use is a problem. Scania is putting a clutch pedal back in its version of the EGS so drivers can override the auto clutch and volvo are reintroducing a manual range change / splitter manual gearbox option. They say this is what owner drivers want, interesting that.
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#10
(22-10-2018, 09:19 AM)polar Wrote:  From what i have seen on here and read elsewhere the EGS do suffer from premature clutch wear in most cases. Maybe most are worn by 50k but that is not the whole picture, the actuator can pack up and then you are into a grand + to get it fixed.

As mentioned earlier in this thread they do work better in the trucks but i do know a lot of drivers hate them. They are fine for trunking up and down the motorway but any off road use is a problem. Scania is putting a clutch pedal back in its version of the EGS so drivers can override the auto clutch and volvo are reintroducing a manual range change / splitter manual gearbox option. They say this is what owner drivers want, interesting that.
Yep. Fair point on the driving preferences. I can only go on the impression I got on my fairly long test drive. I was happy with the feel of the gearbox on the good mix of different roads including quite a bit of stop start in a 20 minute traffic jam. 

To confuse things further, I've had the "don't touch it with a barge pole" response from one of the independent garages I use near me. I've also just had a chat with a really good mobile mechanic that I've had dealings with and he didn't seem bothered. He did have to send one of his customers to a gearbox specialist he works with to replace an actuator once (cost just over £800). But no more issues than any other part of a modern car according to him.
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