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[Engine] [Now solved] 1.6 Hdi 'Missfire' under load (and a clonk)
[Edit] If you want to skip the saga the fault finding is here.

Hi all
First off - a 'hands up' - this is not our Berlingo but a 2008 Mini that has a PSA  110 Hp 1.6 HDi fitted. Reason I'm asking here is that there's a lot more sense on this forum than a hell of a lot of the others out there (how about 'change the coil pack'? On a diesel?)

Beast is a pretty standard HDi of the age - 120K miles black  smoke when cold.  Also  we do have is the equivalent of a missfire under load - feels like an older petrol engine when the timing was out and you floored the throttle - stuttering and no power.

Around 1500-2000 rpm the engine vibrates/knocks around, drop a gear and get the revs over 2000 then it's fairly clean and picks up power, there's no power when this vibration takes place. Quick answer is to run 2 or 3 gears higher and keep the rpm in the 2000 to 3000 band but the fuel gauge does drop quickly. 

Only just got it home so not really had time to play with it much - there's currently no fault codes showing on a generic reader with the Torque app. No warning lights on either.

Googling suggests a couple of ideas mainly fuel pressure sensor or EGR valve stuck. Can anybody add anything to the list for checking?

And finally ... a clonk. Ticking over when hot there's an intermittent 'clonk' which is only really noticeable with the bonnet open and engine cover off. Engine does shake a bit when the clonk occurs but it is not in time with the revs. Feels like it is towards the left hand side of the engine. It has been suggested that a sticking EGR valve can cause this but I cannot find a hard and fast rule on this? Any ideas?


Our cars - 2008 1.6 HDi 92 Berlingo (His)
             - 2008 1.6 HDi 110 Mini (Hers)
             - 2008 1.4 HDi 70 Pug 207 (Sprogs)
My first port of call is disconnecting the MAF sensor when power drops like this. I've seen it on our Berlingo 2.0hdi and a 1,6hdi van.
So where does this bit go then ?
you can rule out the EGR valve by fitting a blanking plate. Even if you only fit it temporarily as a diagnostic aid.
Hi Graeme sound like you are on the right track, obviously change the fuel filter and check the air cleaner first.

Your list is a good starting point the only other thing i can think of is an injector going down - maybe a leak off test may show this but a decent diag would be better.
Hi - thanks chaps, hopefully I'll get a proper chance to play with it over the weekend and I'll get back to you.
Our cars - 2008 1.6 HDi 92 Berlingo (His)
             - 2008 1.6 HDi 110 Mini (Hers)
             - 2008 1.4 HDi 70 Pug 207 (Sprogs)
an injector issue would flag a code tho surely ? i,ve come across a few engines that were lumpy low down and then ran smooth at 2k+ and it was down to poor compression on 1 cyl

Had a quick play yesterday with the MAF unplugged. From cold it was as flat as a pancake between around 1200 - 2000 rpm then whoosh. Once warmed up properly the no power/flat band was now a no power/judder/missfire band. Unplugged also forced the EML light on but no limp mode - Torque app cleared that down happily enough. Torque did show that the turbo boost was not really kicking in until around 2000 rpm (no surprise) but under 2000 rpm it was pretty non existent. Not tried blanking yet as I'm too lazy to cut out a blanking plate so paid £3 to the same guy on eBay that sent the one for the Berlingo.

Today went to trace through the turbo vacuum pipes etc etc and found that the main seal between turbo and inlet manifold was rather, shall we say, fecked. Not allowed to whip the one off the Berlingo to try out on the Mini (SWMBO does not trust me not to break both cars) so it'll be Wednesday before I can get my hands on one.

Funny thing is that there is a receipted turbo & dpf  swap 6,000 miles ago from a BMW main dealer - indeed shiny new turbo and DPF under the bonnet on checking. Got to give them the benefit of the doubt as regards refitting a knackered seal, it may have occurred after the new turbo was fitted but somebody, someplace has 'repaired' a split with insulating tape (and then shoved the blessed thing on at an angle - my guess being that they did not want to take all the air filter box off but just wrestled it back 'as' is')

So, currently awaiting couriers to ship in various parts for a full service plus a new orange seal and we'll see where we get then.

Our cars - 2008 1.6 HDi 92 Berlingo (His)
             - 2008 1.6 HDi 110 Mini (Hers)
             - 2008 1.4 HDi 70 Pug 207 (Sprogs)
p.s. I've spent  a few to many hours trolling through innumerable forums on the topic and one thing that keeps cropping up is that a lot of folks are finding that when there's no fault codes under diagnostics then the garage has no idea what to do.
This car has no codes on it at all (other than the ones I have caused!) and I think this has meant it has been passed from pillar to post as nobody can correctly diagnose the problem and, instead, chuck new parts in to see if that fixes the problem. (turbo, dpf, injectors etc etc)
Having said that the paperwork is showing labour charges of £70 + vat per hour so I can see why folks are reluctant to 'fling good money after bad' on a ten year old car.

p.p.s. The PSA Hdi engine does not half get a lot of abuse 'out there' - you'd think it was the engine designed by Beelzebub himself from what people say about it - maybe they'd be better paying more attention to servicing the things properly?
If there's a new turbo fitted, make sure there's enough oil getting to it. I saw a quick & dirty way to check the oil feed that another forum member linked on YouTube. Basically, you undo the top oil feed banjo with the engine running and see if oil comes out. If you do decide to check that way, make sure you keep the banjo still by putting a screwdriver between the banjo & the turbo housing as the banjo - pipe joint is designed to flex, but not by very much.
Check the injectors are tight with a 7mm allen key (cheap & quick delivery from FFX if you don't have one already).
Good luck with the diagnosis.
guilty as charged Smile

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