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Logic is a myth
#11
Update. I found some easy start and just went nuts. It choked to life after about 20 turns and threw out tonnes of white smoke for a minute or two while I revved it up a bit. The engine then died when I plugged the MAS back in (not 100% sure why I unplugged it) I hoped this might just clear it out or something but it still won't start again both with or without the Mas. Which is basically brand new and worked fine before...

Any ideas? Just to clarify it was starting perfectly before changing the crankshaft sensor and cleaning the pipe that I took a picture of. Strange times
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#12
Sounds like the ECU is not allowing fuel, would still point to the crank sensor or fuel pump relay et al. It sounds like it only ran on easy start cos it was forced to. Is this a Citroen crank sensor or a Chinese copy? Was it idling with no MAF once it started on Bradex? The MAF can be really faulty and without it, the ECU makes an assumption of airflow. Should still run without it pretty well. Maybe worth blanking the EGR and try again, with easy start and no MAF. If it starts and idles, let it run for a bit to clear it's lungs then shut off and put the MAF back on while stopped, and try again. Don't connect or disconnect stuff while it's running, it will not react well.

If it ran on its own once started and only died because you refitted the MAF, I'd be suspecting it as being shot possibly. Worth repeating the exercise with easy start and no MAF, get it running and leave the MAF off, see if it will run and restart once warmed up without the MAF.

If it does, try a MAF from a scrapper?

I'd still block the EGR with a blanking plate.
My Van: 2012 B9 1.6 HDi Enterprise
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#13
Thanks for your help. The maf I bought new after trying one from the scrapy 1st and not seeing a difference. The crankshaft sensor is new from eurocar and looks identical to the one removed. Not sure of the make I'm afraid. It always run with or without the maf without a different which is annoying beings I spend £90 quid on a new one.

So I managed to get it going once again. It took roughly 30 seconds of crank and spluttered to life like it was starved of either fuel or air. I checked the fuel lines and everything is flowing correctly so I'd have to guess at airflow. I left it running floored the pedal to clear the smoke. It's now starting fine and running as normal. I'm absolutely confused and have no trust anymore. Could carbon clogging do this? It's my only logical guess.
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#14
Yeah most definitely. The look of the end of your EGR pipe showed extreme clogging, so your intake will be reduced to a peep. Diesels have no air control or throttle plate, they rev by adding fuel under pressure so if the airflow is restricted it runs rich or simply won't start as the mixture is so very rich.

EGR is the worst thing they could ever have done to diesels. The fumes are oily, heavy with soot, so they build up and clog stuff. Your intake valves will also be seriously clogged up, not closing properly and everything will be clogged with sticky gunk.

Mr muscle could help by dissolving the carbon to a liquid state and the engine will ingest and burn it. You probably shifted enough with the Ether (Easy Start / Bradex) to let it start. It will come back if not de-coked.

Start by blanking the EGR asap, to stop it putting more carbon into the intake. Then you can use Bradex or Sodium hydroxide to clear most if not all of the carbon from the intake tract.

As long as it can get enough air, and no more carbon gets added, it will be usable for you.
My Van: 2012 B9 1.6 HDi Enterprise
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#15
Thank you Zion, I'm going to order some of them pliers to remove the EGR clip and probably buy a new one. I will definitely blank it as it's been on my to do list and now I can justify it after the amount of filth I'm seeing.I may buy another manifold as well as mine is so blocked up I'm sure it's why it wouldn't start.

Never used bradex or sodium hydroxide but I'll certainly look into it. I'm looking forward to getting it cleaned down to see how it runs and if it's successful I might even treat myself to some recon injectors as mine are made up of scrapyard randoms. You should see my leak off test results lol. Boy I've had some issues with this van but I've learnt lots and everyday I learn something new. Todays lesson... Carbon is a bitch ?
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#16
The smileys show as a question mark. I'm not nuts.
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#17
Haha all good calls, a new intake would be a great idea and blank the EGR with a plate off eBay. Bradex is a brand name for easy-start which is a flammable solvent of heptane, (the main component of natural gasoline) with some diethyl ether. Sodium hydroxide is what's in Mr muscle oven cleaner foam spray.

Carbon is immune to all things, except Piranha fluid, which is a mixture of sulfuric acid and 30% hydrogen peroxide, used for cleaning labware and dissolves anything, and I mean anything...so that's out as it would take the carbon, the intake, the engine, you, the tarmac lol you get the idea. The other thing that can remove carbon and absorb it into a solution (emulsion), is sodium hydroxide. Mr muscle.

Easy start can loosen and soften the carbon and again, being combustible it can take it into the engine to be burned. It should never be needed on a modern diesel but in your case it worked.

Oh and smileys from your phone always show as question marks on the forum. Weird huh.
My Van: 2012 B9 1.6 HDi Enterprise
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#18
Oh and if your keeping it now, get DiagBox and a Lexia interface from eBay (it's a set), £45 and worth every penny. Needs a win 7 notebook but not greedy on power so any thing will do. Notebooks tend to have longer lasting batteries. You can code injectors, keys, new parts, change options, diagnostic tests and the best live data from a Citroen you can get.
My Van: 2012 B9 1.6 HDi Enterprise
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#19
Hey, sorry I haven't been around for a while... I haven't done any of this as I'm just so busy but I started a new thread with the entire list of symptoms that my poor little van has. It may well all be related.

And thanks for the heads up on the diagnox/ lexia. I've only got a cheapy £10 reader so this could well help me finally find this ongoing problem.
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#20
I think it's a good place to start (having DiagBox) and I wouldn't want to be without it. I'll take a look at your other thread, hopefully you get to the bottom of it.
My Van: 2012 B9 1.6 HDi Enterprise
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