[Engine] Oil leak

[paradox1001]

Hi everyone I’ve an oil leak on my recently purchased berlingo
Any info and advice on sorting it would be appreciated

[paradox1001]

I’ve zoomed in on the picture to show it
It’s not pouring out but is dripping onto the drive belt

[jj9]

The oil builds up in the pipework and you often see a build up in this location.

The oil gets into the pipework from either the engine breather where it connects to the pipe just before the turbo, or from the turbo itself if the oil seals are past their best and allowing oil to weep out into the air inlet side.

You can route the engine breather into an oil catch can which helps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEoO7-fmMkc


If the turbo is weeping oil you will have to replace it, you can replace just the cartridge part to save on cost.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBTWktDiTGc


Both videos are from a member on this forum, saskak. 



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[paradox1001]

The oil builds up in the pipework and you often see a build up in this location.

The oil gets into the pipework from either the engine breather where it connects to the pipe just before the turbo, or from the turbo itself if the oil seals are past their best and allowing oil to weep out into the air inlet side.

You can route the engine breather into an oil catch can which helps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEoO7-fmMkc


If the turbo is weeping oil you will have to replace it, you can replace just the cartridge part to save on cost.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBTWktDiTGc


Both videos are from a member on this forum, saskak. 



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Thanks for the reply jj9

[saskak]

jj9 is absolutely right that this is oil build up, but there was a fault in the M59s where the doser unit sometimes is not well glued together and oil from the breather/turbo cartridge seeps through. Not too sure if it is the same unit in the B9.

I do not think I have seen a perfect solution, but you could take it apart and try to re-glue. AFAIK it is two parts (top and bottom) that can be re-glued. There were some cases where PSA official solution was to put silicone gasket around the edges. This will stop the oil dripping onto the belt at least, but will not stop oil going through.

[paradox1001]

jj9 is absolutely right that this is oil build up, but there was a fault in the M59s where the doser unit sometimes is not well glued together and oil from the breather/turbo cartridge seeps through. Not too sure if it is the same unit in the B9.

I do not think I have seen a perfect solution, but you could take it apart and try to re-glue. AFAIK it is two parts (top and bottom) that can be re-glued. There were some cases where PSA official solution was to put silicone gasket around the edges. This will stop the oil dripping onto the belt at least, but will not stop oil going through.

Thanks for the info Saskak

I’ve had the turbo air inlet hose off and there is some play in the turbo
I’ve contacted the dealer I bought the car from and he’s said to take it to the mechanic he uses to get it checked out.
So I’m taking it Saturday for him to take a look.

Is there an acceptable amount of play in the turbo or should the be no play felt?

I’m concerned that if the turbo let’s go it will create a lot more damage and expensive repairs
My other concern is with oil in the intake there is the possibility of diesel runaway.

The car is a 2009 1.6 with 84335 miles and full service history but it’s not main dealer service history.

I understand there is a crank case breather before the turbo so some oil mist/fumes will be drawn into the inlet I just don’t know how much is acceptable or excessive.

I had to borrow the money to buy this car as I needed something reliable and I really can’t afford for it to go wrong.

[saskak]

jj9 is absolutely right that this is oil build up, but there was a fault in the M59s where the doser unit sometimes is not well glued together and oil from the breather/turbo cartridge seeps through. Not too sure if it is the same unit in the B9.

I do not think I have seen a perfect solution, but you could take it apart and try to re-glue. AFAIK it is two parts (top and bottom) that can be re-glued. There were some cases where PSA official solution was to put silicone gasket around the edges. This will stop the oil dripping onto the belt at least, but will not stop oil going through.

Thanks for the info Saskak

I’ve had the turbo air inlet hose off and there is some play in the turbo
I’ve contacted the dealer I bought the car from and he’s said to take it to the mechanic he uses to get it checked out.
So I’m taking it Saturday for him to take a look.

Is there an acceptable amount of play in the turbo or should the be no play felt?

I’m concerned that if the turbo let’s go it will create a lot more damage and expensive repairs
My other concern is with oil in the intake there is the possibility of diesel runaway.

The car is a 2009 1.6 with 84335 miles and full service history but it’s not main dealer service history.

I understand there is a crank case breather before the turbo so some oil mist/fumes will be drawn into the inlet I just don’t know how much is acceptable or excessive.

I had to borrow the money to buy this car as I needed something reliable and I really can’t afford for it to go wrong.

Here is how it looks like with an acceptable amount of turbo shaft play: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ML49tY9Pgk
TBH, I do not think anyone knows what is the acceptable amount of crankcase breather oil. If the engine is warmed up and you are not seeing constant blue smoke, it should be alright. It really depends on how heavy a breather is the car, is there an excessive wear and the crankcase pressure is high, forcing a bit more oil.

I will let the others reply on diesel runaway, etc.

[paradox1001]

jj9 is absolutely right that this is oil build up, but there was a fault in the M59s where the doser unit sometimes is not well glued together and oil from the breather/turbo cartridge seeps through. Not too sure if it is the same unit in the B9.

I do not think I have seen a perfect solution, but you could take it apart and try to re-glue. AFAIK it is two parts (top and bottom) that can be re-glued. There were some cases where PSA official solution was to put silicone gasket around the edges. This will stop the oil dripping onto the belt at least, but will not stop oil going through.

Thanks for the info Saskak

I’ve had the turbo air inlet hose off and there is some play in the turbo
I’ve contacted the dealer I bought the car from and he’s said to take it to the mechanic he uses to get it checked out.
So I’m taking it Saturday for him to take a look.

Is there an acceptable amount of play in the turbo or should the be no play felt?

I’m concerned that if the turbo let’s go it will create a lot more damage and expensive repairs
My other concern is with oil in the intake there is the possibility of diesel runaway.

The car is a 2009 1.6 with 84335 miles and full service history but it’s not main dealer service history.

I understand there is a crank case breather before the turbo so some oil mist/fumes will be drawn into the inlet I just don’t know how much is acceptable or excessive.

I had to borrow the money to buy this car as I needed something reliable and I really can’t afford for it to go wrong.

Here is how it looks like with an acceptable amount of turbo shaft play: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ML49tY9Pgk
TBH, I do not think anyone knows what is the acceptable amount of crankcase breather oil. If the engine is warmed up and you are not seeing constant blue smoke, it should be alright. It really depends on how heavy a breather is the car, is there an excessive wear and the crankcase pressure is high, forcing a bit more oil.

I will let the others reply on diesel runaway, etc.

Thanks for the video
I’ve had mine back apart and the play seems similar
Mine may have slightly more radial play but it’s hard to tell.
I completely removed the intake pipe from the car
(Is that the maf at the top near the air box?)
There was some oil from the breather in the intake pipe but not enough to pour out.
I’ve cleaned it all out so I can check how much collects over time.
I did find this seal split where the pipe meets the turbo but I doubt it’s leaking but I’ll get a replacement for it anyway.
I take it it’s a main dealer only part?


Is it excessive play in the turbo that causes the oil seals to fail or are they known to fail of the own accord?

If it is the turbo oil seals that are allowing oil through then does that mean the oil is condensing in the intercooler and it’s likely to be full of oil and then this is getting sucked further up and pooling at the point in the first pictures?

I’d like to have a good understanding of it all before I go to the mechanic on Saturday so i don’t get fobbed off.
I appreciate all the help so far.

The air filter housing looks quite tucked away
Is it difficult to replace the filter and also how do you go about removing the intercooler to clean it out?

[GraemeT]

For the engine to diesel on the oil it needs to have a constant supply (e.g. seal failure some place important) - small amounts in the inlet manifold are not going to generate a complete runaway. Some people like to fit a 'catch can' for peace of mind - I'm pretty sure there's some posts on here about that - that would maybe give some sort of measurement of blow by volume? Giving an idea of how much is too much if you pull the breather off is difficult - I've always though that there was more than I'd expect but it's probably just millilitres I'm seeing - the only HDi we have currently is the 110 BHP one in the Mini and that always has some oil in the breather but never needs a topup between services.

I had the leaky 'doseur' on the 1.6 HDi 90BHP Berlingo (2008 model) and tried the glue trick - turned out to be easier in the end to just source a secondhand unit from eBay, swap over the sensors et voila. 

Had a full runaway twice - once on a Citroen van that ate the head gasket at 16,000 miles. That one could be stalled out in a high gear. The other was a Ford tractor which could not be stalled out so it was a case of operator runaway (far, far, away) and watch in wonder - that one did have an oil bath air cleaner on it but judging by the time and spectacularity of the burn off it was either drinking the sump or had that as the main course after the air cleaner hors d'oeuvres.

Some suggest starving the engine of air if it all goes pear shaped - personally I'm not willing to pop the bonnet to block the turbo inlet whilst the engine is doing 10,000 rpm - I have vision of a turbo implosion promoted instant vasectomy (or worse). There's probably a YouTube video by a twelve year old on how to stop a runaway but I'm allergic (to YouTube and twelve year olds and vasecomies).

[jj9]

@ saskak you have made some very informative videos, I'm sure a lot of people on this forum and around the World have benefited from them.


Paradox,

I've never seen a diesel engined vehicle be it normally aspirated or a turbo that doesn't have oil in the inlet manifold.
As mentioned this normally comes from the engine breather valve or Positive Crankcase Ventilation valve (PCV) as it referred to and it accumulates over time in the pipework. 

The turbo bearings can be fine (little shaft movement) but it can still let some oil past if the oil seals have worn.

Yes you will more than likely find a build up of oil in the intercooler, could be worth taking it off and cleaning it out, saskak has a video on cleaning the intercooler   

A lot of people forget that the turbo is a serviceable item, it will wear with age, they can go on for years letting a little oil past.
The play on the shaft is also a topic of controversy, saskak's video is a good example of the play you are likely to find.

To be honest I don't think you will get any joy from the dealer / mechanic unless the turbo is catching the housing or bucketing oil out, "They're all like that"  is a probable answer and he won't be that wrong!


Regarding a diesel runaway,
The oil in the intake that you are seeing is very very unlikely to cause a runaway, the most common cause of runaway is when the turbo suddenly starts to let a lot of oil into the inlet side due to sudden failure of the oil seal, which is very rare.

That said anyone who drives a diesel engine vehicle should be aware that a runaway can happen and be prepared to deal with it, rather than just stand there and watch the engine destroy itself.

You need to stop the engine as soon as possible, put it into top gear and gently let the clutch out with your foot on the brake and stall it. If you're moving get into top gear and bring the vehicle to a controlled stop to stall it.
You can try and block the air supply but as Graeme says it's quite a scary thing when it happens and your inclined to want to stay away from the engine. 


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