Roof Bar Vs Roof Rail

[harringtonp]

I'm looking for the best occasional fitting solution for a 2012 Citroen Berlingo van.

I see you can get specific roof bars for the van at:

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/142478997279

You could try and fit a roof box to these bars but I get the impression they would not be suitable for roof boxes due to the spacing between the bars unlikely to be the spacing required for the roof box. Is this correct ?

Alternatively would it generally be considered better to get rails such as

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/283668991354

and leave these rails permanently on the vehicle ? They look like they are aerodynamic and don't increase the height of the vehicle much so you can still easily get under barriers. Then when needing to carry a roof box or whatever, roof bars can be attached to  the rails and the box to the bars.

Any advice on which approach is best ?

[theraginganarchist]

I have the exact ultibars you linked.

I picked them up on ebay for £20 local collection.

I was informed that a lot of the aftermarket roof rails are not very good and as the original Citroen ones are expensive new (£260) or hard to come by second hand it was a easy choice to make.

I have not attempted to fit a roof box to the bars as I don't have one.

I believe that with rails you would also need the cross bars to fit most accessories such as roof boxes and again - the cheap ones might not inspire too much confidence.

The advantage of bars is that you get loads second hand from builders vans, they tend to be build strong and they have T-track load stops for securing loads. The disadvantage is that the are not very aerodynamic and look utilitarian if left in place.

I don't use mine very often so having to remove and them is not too much of a issue, but I guess you need to consider how often you might be doing so and of course how it looks aesthetically

[harringtonp]

Thanks for your response. I noticed alright that some of the aftermarket rails are rated for low weights which had me wondering about quality, for example there is 45kg rating on

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/291680856896

I gather you find the ultibars good, I see the advantage of being able to tie things directly to them. And while the rails do look sleek you are introducing an extra layer with bars to get things on the roof. 

It's a pity that roof boxes can't adapt to arbitrary distances between the bars, if they could this would be ideal.

[theraginganarchist]

Yeah I found the utlibars to be good, they are UK made so you can trust the ratings/materials slightly more than the ones probably made in China.

As I was buying them second hand my non scientific test of their integrity was to stand on them (before fitting to car)

I weigh over 100kg and each bar took my weight without flexing.

Cheap roof racks scare me to be honest, It's not just the weight pushing down that you need to consider, the up force of the wind coming over the windscreen is almost impossible to quantify and with something like a roofbox or a sheet of material this will be amplified and fluctuate due to any number of factors. Thin aluminium has a tendency to tear when exposed to frequent stresses like this and will just give way without much of a warning.

As for securing a roof box, it would depend on the internal design of the one in question but I think most of them have metal bars which offer some degree of flexibility with regards to where the mounting points locate.

This might sound a bit scabby but my local recycling centre/rubbish tip re-sells a lot of dumped stuff. There is always a pile of roof boxes and racks perhaps yours' has some you can go and investigate? even if you don't want a used one you can see what type might fit.

[malgpz900]

Never fitted my roof box to my Berlingo but just checked mounting points. 3 roof bar mounting points 24" and 20" spacings. Roof box has adjustable mounting points from 18" to 32" so roof box would easily fit.
Aiko roof bars and Halfords roof box.
Malcolm.

[cliffy]

I bought some TX3 Sahara roof rails a few years ago plus some Diamond cross bars to fit. The roof rails stay on permanently and I put the cross bars on when needed. the Diamond cross bars were about £40, and have a gently rounded rather than flat profile that looks right on the Berlingo. (You can also buy cross bars that include a lock too which I should have thought about in retrospect). The roof rails look sleek, but I found that the three bolt holes didn't quite line up by about 2 mm. - I simply had to extend one of the end holes with a drill to overcome this. Annoying but not a game changer. (I suspect this issue was because the holes were drilled before the roof rail curve was created.) Hope this helps.

[harringtonp]

Thanks for replies guys. It sounds like some roof boxes at least can cope with variable spacing between bars so bars directly on the roof may be the solution I'll run with.

Just a thought, once you pop the caps out of the bolt holes can they be easily popped back in again ? In other words are they designed for repeatedly putting bars on and taking them off again ?

[theraginganarchist]

The first time I took the caps out I had to destroy them to get them out.

This could well have been due to the 7 or 8 years of crap sitting in the threads.

It will probably be a easier job once the threads have had bolts and lube in them.

As I said in your other thread they are only 37p each so I have a bag full as I am impatient and heavy handed.

Removed with care they will probably survive repeated removal, you certainly won't harm the threaded holes, just the plastic plugs, it will be the large flat heads you can already see which will break first.

I must admit though, I have only actually fitted and my roof rack once in the year I have owned it so am unsure how durable those plugs are. They aren't water tight so I don't think there would be much harm in leaving them out if you needed frequent access.

With that in mind though I would suggest you use stainless bolts, not sure what the female threads are made of but the last thing you want is a rusted on roof rack!

[Sol]

The roof hole threads have a very slight taper to them and proper Citroen roof bolts go straight in. Standard M8s bind up easily. I have a factory set of roof rails on now, having tried crappy aftermarket ones and ordinary M8 bolts, which were a nightmare to screw in. I ended up having to get proper OEM bolts which have a very large dome head on them and are Torx. They go in like butter. Use copper slip or any other HMP grease, and stop when they bottom out in the blind hole. Those roof nuts are pressed into the body shell and there is no way you will ever change them if you bugger the thread or twist them loose.

Stainless bolts into mild steel socket nuts will pick-up and bind. Stainless is too soft for a strong fixing like this. Plus they aren't standard M8 anyway.

Factory roof rail bolts are hardened black steel like 440 or HCS and they are toughened.

   

   

[theraginganarchist]

The "proper OEM" bolts will only be suitable for the OEM roof rails as they are a specific length to go through the body of them.