Diesel fuel pump on way out???

[kingy1912]

Hi All,

2016 1.6 Blue HDI

The car has been back in the garage today due to rough idling and struggles getting up hills. It started last week but I was away for a few days and wanted to see how it went when I came back. On way up road from the ferry it started doing it all again. 

So ultimately it ends with rough idling and rpm struggles. It seems to happen more when I go round corners, roundabouts or up and down hills. Within 20-30 seconds of doing this the engine starts to stutter and struggle to accelerate. If I stop and let it idle then idle is tougher than a badgers arse. After a few min it settles and runs fine until the next corner or bad bump in the road. It started at a half quarter tank then a quarter tank and now does it on less than half a tank.

The garage has diagnosed a new HP injection pump. The removed the filter and found debris in the housing making them think the pump is breaking down inside.

Problem is I remember when the HDi’s first appeared on the scene the lift pumps in the tank were notorious for failing. The symptoms I’m getting seem to me to be very like air being drawn through the fuel. Especially when turning corners etc.

What I’m looking to find out is what the best way to confirm these issues are?? The garage is insisting upon a HPI pump but there is no fault codes stored in the system either. The thing that is puzzling me is that if the HPI pump and not the sender unit in the tank is on it way out why would debris appear in the filter behind it.

If the diesel goes tank pump - filter - HPI pump - injectors then why would the debris be where it is. I would imagine if the filter is catching contamination it would be because it is coming from the tank.

Any help is appreciated as the garage has never seen this issue before.

Thanks

[brodfather11]

The HPi pump is a robust piece and not prone to breaking up.

As you suspect I'd look at the lift pump in the tank and the connectors , electrical and fuel which would mean lowering the tank for access,

[pluggit1]

Second that. Too many garages dive straight for the pump only to find that it wasnt. Keep it simple and work methodically from one end to the other. Problem is, its in THEIR hands and not yours. Its very difficult to tell them their job and may take offence. Rock and hard place...

[cancunia]

Is there a lift pump on the B9?

[kingy1912]

Hi folks thanks for replying.

As far as I’m aware there is a lift pump on it as I don’t have a primer on it and the technical diagrams at parts appears to show one.

The garage is very good and are prepared to take advice. They are actually a Honda garage but the server e manager was my service manager when I had stuff at Citroen.

I am going to try and get a hold of the photo from the mechanic as I t shows metal fines in the filter housing. He says he feels it’s breaking down and passing the fines back through the return to the tank and then the system is pulling the fines through the filter system.

For now they have changed the filter and added an additive to expel water from the system. They said the tank need dropped to clean the system anyway so I would look to get the tank dropped to check the lift pump first then we can move on from there.

I think it’s also important to mention as I though I did before but had not that the car has done 330K so HP pump failure would be possible at that mileage would it not??

Thanks

[kingy1912]

Please see the attached jpg of a photo taken of the metal fines in the house.

[cancunia]

Doesn't look so bad for 330k miles, has it been cleaned out before?

Do you have access to an OBD reader and the Torque app or Lexia / Diagbox? You could monitor the rail pressure & boost etc.

[kingy1912]

Hi Cancunia,

No I don’t have access to those I can look in to buying one. I have access to a handheld scanner but it don’t really do very much.

To be honest when I seen it I didn’t think it was that bad either. It has never been cleaned to my knowledge although it may have been done while it was in for another job but I have never asked or paid for it to be done.

So far I have done about 40 miles in the car since leaving the garage and I’ve not had any further issue. They also added an additive called petrol doctor in to it which is used to disperse water in the tank.

So at the moment I’m not really sure if it has been contaminated diesel causing it and it’s been sucking up crap from the tank when I turn corners. Or as I have seen before the lift pump starts to go so if you drive with less than a certain amount it sucks air with the diesel.

I am working in the car tonight if it goes ok tonight I would say it’s fine. Before I went away it was doing it everyday. When I put it in to the garage on Tuesday night I was constant shuddering and struggle to get above 40mph. Yet today I’ve had none of that.

Thanks

[kingy1912]

My dads cousin is a very good mechanic and he says they see the problem of metal fines in higher mileage Peugeot and Citroen’s a lot. They just replace the filter and clean the housing more often and put a fuel additive through it and he says they always seem to keep running.

He also said to check the rail pressures as Cancunia says ans if the pressures look ok then the pump is probably fine.

[kingy1912]

Car been running fine still so suspecting it may just have been dirty fuel/filter. I’ve ordered a torque OBD2 so I will see if I can monitor the rail pressure.