New member M59 1.6 16v gasoline

[marcrbarker]

Hello All in Forum. New member. UK Ex pat abroad in Canary Islands.  I have a 2003 facelift Berlingo. Tried to post photo but not sure come through.   I think the full id is a petrol M59 1.6 16v TU5 JP4 (NFU). Cars don't go rusty here they don't salt the roads.

I've mainly come here to look for a wiring diagram of around the engine ECU and all the sensors, what the wire colors and connector pin numbers are.

[Multispacer]

Hello All in Forum. New member. UK Ex pat abroad in Canary Islands.  I have a 2003 facelift Berlingo. Tried to post photo but not sure come through.   I think the full id is a petrol M59 1.6 16v TU5 JP4 (NFU). Cars don't go rusty here they don't salt the roads.

I've mainly come here to look for a wiring diagram of around the engine ECU and all the sensors, what the wire colors and connector pin numbers are.

If you look in the Berlingo M59 Sub forum [which is the your model] you might find some diagrams. Otherwise ask a question in that forum and hopefully a member will post something.

Is there a reason you are after diagrams, have you got problems?

[marcrbarker]

Hello All in Forum. New member. UK Ex pat abroad in Canary Islands.  I have a 2003 facelift Berlingo. Tried to post photo but not sure come through.   I think the full id is a petrol M59 1.6 16v TU5 JP4 (NFU). Cars don't go rusty here they don't salt the roads.

I've mainly come here to look for a wiring diagram of around the engine ECU and all the sensors, what the wire colors and connector pin numbers are.

If you look in the Berlingo M59 Sub forum [which is the your model] you might find some diagrams. Otherwise ask a question in that forum and hopefully a member will post something.

Is there a reason you are after diagrams, have you got problems?

Hi Multispacer thanks for reply.  I had searched the archives and only seemed to find conversations about it but no actual wiring diagrams themselves. So after that I started a new thread on M59 asked for. (engine ECU and everything connected) 

Need diagrams to find whats wrong with it now I've given up with different mechanics they keep finding fault the whole time and replacing different things one after the other. Because a wire looks a bit discoloured or a DTC code appeared after they unplug things to check the pins are cleaned, the latest mechanic has took each and every fuse out one by one and cleaned it, that was after said the thing wrong conveniently so happens to be the most expensive part and almost unobtainable.  It's a long story, I don't think they have a clue what they are doing so I'm going to have to do it myself.

[Multispacer]

Hello All in Forum. New member. UK Ex pat abroad in Canary Islands.  I have a 2003 facelift Berlingo. Tried to post photo but not sure come through.   I think the full id is a petrol M59 1.6 16v TU5 JP4 (NFU). Cars don't go rusty here they don't salt the roads.

I've mainly come here to look for a wiring diagram of around the engine ECU and all the sensors, what the wire colours and connector pin numbers are.

If you look in the Berlingo M59 Sub forum [which is the your model] you might find some diagrams. Otherwise ask a question in that forum and hopefully a member will post something.

Is there a reason you are after diagrams, have you got problems?

Hi Multispacer thanks for reply.  I had searched the archives and only seemed to find conversations about it but no actual wiring diagrams themselves. So after that I started a new thread on M59 asked for. (engine ECU and everything connected) 

Need diagrams to find what's wrong with it now I've given up with different mechanics they keep finding fault the whole time and replacing different things one after the other. Because a wire looks a bit discoloured or a DTC code appeared after they unplug things to check the pins are cleaned, the latest mechanic has took each and every fuse out one by one and cleaned it, that was after said the thing wrong conveniently so happens to be the most expensive part and almost unobtainable.  It's a long story, I don't think they have a clue what they are doing so I'm going to have to do it myself.

Okay, so what's actually wrong with the vehicle?

Was there anything in this thread of use: https://www.berlingoforum.com/thread-17165.html

[marcrbarker]

I don't know yet that's what I need the diagrams for. They don't diagnose anything here just keep replacing parts related to whatever words appear on scantool screen.

Yes similar to the diesel diagrams posted in link, but I want the ones for gasoline engine 1.6i 16v.

[marcrbarker]

There's no regular trail of symptoms/cause to follow it's too convoluted now because too many different mechanics have added more problems.  

Fir example latest problem is battery killed by starter motor failed caused by new battery burning it out after no start during repeated attempts to start it trying to prime fuel line, caused by belief that air lock in fuel after empty fuel gauge believed culprit of no start, happened after various failed interventions to find cause of limp mode.

edit.. What I think the only relavent DTCs are (among all the many others) is P1613 which might be related with undiagnosed limp mode.  And P0335 which is what diagrams are for, can't possibly be TWO faulty replacement crank sensors that's too improbable.

[Multispacer]

There's no regular trail of symptoms/cause to follow it's too convoluted now because too many different mechanics have added more problems.  

Fir example latest problem is battery killed by starter motor failed caused by new battery burning it out after no start during repeated attempts to start it trying to prime fuel line, caused by belief that air lock in fuel after empty fuel gauge believed culprit of no start, happened after various failed interventions to find cause of limp mode.

edit.. What I think the only relavent DTCs are (among all the many others) is P1613 which might be related with undiagnosed limp mode.  And P0335 which is what diagrams are for, can't possibly be TWO faulty replacement crank sensors that's too improbable.

Your post made me think about a video I saw a few months back, you might want to watch it:

https://youtu.be/8dtv1kRNF_U?si=skfo5RT70ucWoNcL

It looks as if there may be a batch of dodgy Bosch crankshaft sensors around as this guy spent a lot of time/effort on fault finding to find out the the new Bosch sensor fitted wasn't working correctly. He replaced it with a cheaper ERA? one and the 'no crank fault' was cured.

You might be lucky and this is also your problem.


Another thing that has been mentioned about non-stating vehicles by another forum member:

Older French cars had a fuel cut off that cut the power to the fuel pump in an impact.
Also cuts the power if turned upside down if you are disassembling things around the engine bay.
IF yours has one,
It will look like a one inch OXO cube with a rubber button on the top.
Press the rubber button.

[marcrbarker]

I hope I don't come over in bad light saying this but I'm trying to break the endless loop caused by mechanics where I am who hoping to get lucky following internet forums instead of diagnosing with common sense. The mechanics all they do here is type symptoms and code number into google and then blindly go round the loop over and over replacing things by 'pattern matching' often with substandard parts (as you mention dodgy batches).

Example is two the mechanics both of them adamant (after reading on internet) "is a common fault the crash knock sensor near the bulkhead and it must be replaced its the only way to know for sure" and "must never be bypassed a safety feature". This was the exact point by the way for me confirmed don't know what they're doing.
Both times it didn't register to them when I connect a continuity tester to it and demonstrated the switch opens when bang it, and then it closes again when press the button. Then tried to find fault with the way I did the test and each said they "have to replace it first with brand new one anyway to confirm" what they saw. And none of that explains the limp mode anyway.

So now I've been round the loop enough times with what read on internet, faulty replacement sensors and crash sensors and all the 'common faults' that coincide with perceived symptoms come up on google /chatgpt, for me it's now the hour to find what's wrong myself.
Starting with Wiring Diagram for the petrol version, first task is scope the pulse train from the crank sensor. And all the other signals the ECU is expecting. For that need wiring diagram. It usually also shows signal names and sometimes what to test.

[Multispacer]

I hope I don't come over in bad light saying this but I'm trying to break the endless loop caused by mechanics where I am who hoping to get lucky following internet forums instead of diagnosing with common sense.  The mechanics all they do here is type symptoms and code number into google and then blindly go round the loop over and over replacing things by 'pattern matching' often with substandard parts (as you mention dodgy batches).

Example is two the mechanics both of them adamant (after reading on internet) is a common fault the knock sensor and it must be replaced the only way to know for sure and must never be bypassed a safety feature. This was the exact point by the way for me confirmed don't know what they're doing.
Both times it didn't register to them when I connect a continuity tester to the crash knock sensor near the bulkhead and demonstrated the switch opens when bang it, and then it closes again when press the button. Both tried to find fault with the way I did the test and both said they have to replace it first with brand new one anyway to confirm what they saw. And none of that explains the limp mode anyway.

So now I've been round the loop enough times with what read on internet, faulty replacement sensors and crash sensors and all the 'common faults' that coincide with perceived symptoms come up on google /chatgpt, for me it's now the hour to find what's wrong myself.
Starting with Wiring Diagram for the petrol version, first task is scope the pulse train from the crank sensor. And all the other signals the ECU is expecting. For that need wiring diagram. It usually also shows signal names and sometimes what to test.

I can see why you're frustrated. There are diagrams in the Haynes manual which might help, have you got a copy, there are always a number of used ones on Ebay [had a quick look on ebay.es and some on there as well] https://www.ebay.es/sch/i.html?_from=R40...l&_sacat=0

The one other thing I would ask is when the vehicle is being scanned are they using the correct scanning tools? Generic OBD readers [in general, there are a few exceptions] do not work on PSA group vehicles. They have to be scanned using either a Lexia or Peugeot Planet type set up.

When I had my M59 model Multispace, I had a similar situation in that [even] the local Citroen dealer wanted to start changing all sorts of components after I started getting 'passenger airbag' messages [MOT fail] even though the fault scan showed there wasn't a response from a number of items [they wouldn't all have failed] I took away the scan results and went through all the wiring [from the Haynes Manual] and found a broken data wire between the engine bay fuse box and the BSI. I never actually found where it was broken but I just ran in a new wire between the two points and everything was good.

[marcrbarker]

Trouble with the factory scan tools is they pull out even more DTCs which often isn't a help. Each DTC is another potential wild goose chase, (or more paying work for the mechanic to replace something else unscrewable). Most cars over a certain age collect various DTCs anyway that doesn't stop them running, some DTCs throw the warning light every now and again, other DTCs never do. Then when there's later on a no-starting fault comes along then all these DTCs attract irrelavent work. And then there's extra DTCs on top of that get triggered each time unplug sensors, which is why mr. mechanic gets in habit 'clearing the codes', so he doesn't go off chasing more red herrings that weren't there before. 

Your passenger airbag fault sounds like one of the CANbus data wire. It's daisychained to various components in common with them. 

That's the trouble with "Diagnostics" now, no one seems to use logical thinking but instead they just find whatever is easily unscrewable that relates to on screen message, or in your case do the whole long list of them one by one. And because this replacement for the sake of it frenzy is so widespread is pushing down the sell cost of these parts, so china responds often with suspect build quality to meet the price. Original parts the car built with were often better than replacements. 

I was going to ask you where you got your diesel wiring diagrams from so I could go there same place myself. I guess it's going to be a bought thing, not something you can find online...