Dropped a valve ?

[Skittles]

I’m guessing that making the extra oil changes helped my engine to get to 111k before self destructing.
My loan Berlingo has now done 35k (56000km)  - I’m wondering what they would say if their van suffers the same  problem at 60000km ?

Sorry to bring an old thread up, but got a Peugeot 308sw in that has the 1.5 bluehdi engine. Twin cam version late 2018.
90,000 miles on clock. 
Belt kit changed at 87,000 miles. Serviced every 10,000 miles or less. Looked after very well. Private hire vehicle. One careful lady driver. 
3 weeks after belt change, engine light came on. 2 faults stored, regarding air flow high, and low. (outside parameters) 
Initially suspected egr valve, after confirming belt timing was still 100%,and replaced with genuine part. The faults remained.
Not wanting to throw good money after bad, and conferring with other mechanics, recommended a dealer diagnostic. 
Dealers diagnosed air flow meter as a starting point, They duly changed it, and lightened my customers purse by just over £400.
2.5 miles later the light was back on. She returned to dealers, who frightened the s**t out of her by saying it needed to be put on a different diagnostic machine, and there were 17 steps to go through. Basically, they were going to throw parts at it, exactly what I was trying to avoid. Their estimate on cost was upwards of £5000 for a new engine. 
So despite the voices in my head screaming "don't touch that pile of French s**t!", I took it back on.
Here's a list of symptoms. 
Cold start rattle, like a vauxhall corsa. 
Poor turbo performance. Laggy and no top end. 
Pulsing through inlet system, like cam timing out or bent valve.
Emissions slightly higher, failed mot test. 

So, I reluctantly stripped the cam box off today. Didn't want to, but everything pointed to cam chain. After 2 hours at a snails pace, it was removed. Not really a bad job, but when you don't wanna...... 

EUREKA!!!!!! 

The cam chain tensioner is broken. No obvious major damage. Will need to do a leak down test for valve damage. The camshafts have pressed on lobes, so they are questionable. They may have spun if the valves hit the pistons. 
So it needs a minimum of a chain and tensioner kit. Maybe camshafts to be safe. Probably will be genuine parts. I haven't found any pattern ones available yet. 
It will live again! 

But here's the rub. The dealers know about this fault. There was a bulletin issued, and the service agent did mention a chain issue to my customer. It depends on the chain size, 7 or 8mm. The 7mm chain is the issue, and should be covered by peugeot. The thinnest chain links do measure up at 7mm,so this job may have been covered, even outside warranty limits. But my customer is rightly untrusting of the dealership now. They should have known this could have been the problem all along, and acted in good faith. Instead they've fleeced her of over £400.

I hope these symptoms might help others with the same issue. It's been a headscratcher. Not what you'd expect from a relatively young car. I'll post the final results once the job is finished.

[Sol]

It may be young but it's done the miles of a much older car. You're right though, the dealer should have been aware of the TSB and in fact when accessing Servicebox they should have been alerted to this potential issue - all possible fixes or causes are highlighted in the tech documents on the Servicebox TSB & diagnostic section.

Tells me they didn't even look.

Anyway all that apart, very well found on your part, and commendation for being so thorough. Excellent find.

[chrisl]

It may be young but it's done the miles of a much older car. You're right though, the dealer should have been aware of the TSB and in fact when accessing Servicebox they should have been alerted to this potential issue - all possible fixes or causes are highlighted in the tech documents on the Servicebox TSB & diagnostic section.

Tells me they didn't even look.

Anyway all that apart, very well found on your part, and commendation for being so thorough. Excellent find.

So pleased that you found the faulty tensioner,my own van was totally unreliable after having an engine,turbo etc etc etc at the dealer. I picked up a new xl 130 eat in July 22 and vowed to dealer service it so it stays in warranty without question.
It’s now got 55k miles on it in 6 months and they say my van ordered sept 21 should arrive mid March .
That will be dealer serviced too, I’ve never done it before with my previous 6 Berlingo vans but I’m scarred for life now !

[ItsGreen]

I’m guessing that making the extra oil changes helped my engine to get to 111k before self destructing.
My loan Berlingo has now done 35k (56000km)  - I’m wondering what they would say if their van suffers the same  problem at 60000km ?

Sorry to bring an old thread up, but got a Peugeot 308sw in that has the 1.5 bluehdi engine. Twin cam version late 2018.
90,000 miles on clock. 
Belt kit changed at 87,000 miles. Serviced every 10,000 miles or less. Looked after very well. Private hire vehicle. One careful lady driver. 
3 weeks after belt change, engine light came on. 2 faults stored, regarding air flow high, and low. (outside parameters) 
Initially suspected egr valve, after confirming belt timing was still 100%,and replaced with genuine part. The faults remained.
Not wanting to throw good money after bad, and conferring with other mechanics, recommended a dealer diagnostic. 
Dealers diagnosed air flow meter as a starting point, They duly changed it, and lightened my customers purse by just over £400.
2.5 miles later the light was back on. She returned to dealers, who frightened the s**t out of her by saying it needed to be put on a different diagnostic machine, and there were 17 steps to go through. Basically, they were going to throw parts at it, exactly what I was trying to avoid. Their estimate on cost was upwards of £5000 for a new engine. 
So despite the voices in my head screaming "don't touch that pile of French s**t!", I took it back on.
Here's a list of symptoms. 
Cold start rattle, like a vauxhall corsa. 
Poor turbo performance. Laggy and no top end. 
Pulsing through inlet system, like cam timing out or bent valve.
Emissions slightly higher, failed mot test. 

So, I reluctantly stripped the cam box off today. Didn't want to, but everything pointed to cam chain. After 2 hours at a snails pace, it was removed. Not really a bad job, but when you don't wanna...... 

EUREKA!!!!!! 

The cam chain tensioner is broken. No obvious major damage. Will need to do a leak down test for valve damage. The camshafts have pressed on lobes, so they are questionable. They may have spun if the valves hit the pistons. 
So it needs a minimum of a chain and tensioner kit. Maybe camshafts to be safe. Probably will be genuine parts. I haven't found any pattern ones available yet. 
It will live again! 

But here's the rub. The dealers know about this fault. There was a bulletin issued, and the service agent did mention a chain issue to my customer. It depends on the chain size, 7 or 8mm. The 7mm chain is the issue, and should be covered by peugeot. The thinnest chain links do measure up at 7mm,so this job may have been covered, even outside warranty limits. But my customer is rightly untrusting of the dealership now. They should have known this could have been the problem all along, and acted in good faith. Instead they've fleeced her of over £400.

I hope these symptoms might help others with the same issue. It's been a headscratcher. Not what you'd expect from a relatively young car. I'll post the final results once the job is finished.

I'm not up on the 1.5's, but I know on the older 1.6's you could buy aftermarket proper, old-fashioned solid camshafts. The downside is though, if it pops another chain, you're definitely going to need to change valves, so it's a bit hard decision to make.

[james1089]

I’m guessing that making the extra oil changes helped my engine to get to 111k before self destructing.
My loan Berlingo has now done 35k (56000km)  - I’m wondering what they would say if their van suffers the same  problem at 60000km ?

Sorry to bring an old thread up, but got a Peugeot 308sw in that has the 1.5 bluehdi engine. Twin cam version late 2018.
90,000 miles on clock. 
Belt kit changed at 87,000 miles. Serviced every 10,000 miles or less. Looked after very well. Private hire vehicle. One careful lady driver. 
3 weeks after belt change, engine light came on. 2 faults stored, regarding air flow high, and low. (outside parameters) 
Initially suspected egr valve, after confirming belt timing was still 100%,and replaced with genuine part. The faults remained.
Not wanting to throw good money after bad, and conferring with other mechanics, recommended a dealer diagnostic. 
Dealers diagnosed air flow meter as a starting point, They duly changed it, and lightened my customers purse by just over £400.
2.5 miles later the light was back on. She returned to dealers, who frightened the s**t out of her by saying it needed to be put on a different diagnostic machine, and there were 17 steps to go through. Basically, they were going to throw parts at it, exactly what I was trying to avoid. Their estimate on cost was upwards of £5000 for a new engine. 
So despite the voices in my head screaming "don't touch that pile of French s**t!", I took it back on.
Here's a list of symptoms. 
Cold start rattle, like a vauxhall corsa. 
Poor turbo performance. Laggy and no top end. 
Pulsing through inlet system, like cam timing out or bent valve.
Emissions slightly higher, failed mot test. 

So, I reluctantly stripped the cam box off today. Didn't want to, but everything pointed to cam chain. After 2 hours at a snails pace, it was removed. Not really a bad job, but when you don't wanna...... 

EUREKA!!!!!! 

The cam chain tensioner is broken. No obvious major damage. Will need to do a leak down test for valve damage. The camshafts have pressed on lobes, so they are questionable. They may have spun if the valves hit the pistons. 
So it needs a minimum of a chain and tensioner kit. Maybe camshafts to be safe. Probably will be genuine parts. I haven't found any pattern ones available yet. 
It will live again! 

But here's the rub. The dealers know about this fault. There was a bulletin issued, and the service agent did mention a chain issue to my customer. It depends on the chain size, 7 or 8mm. The 7mm chain is the issue, and should be covered by peugeot. The thinnest chain links do measure up at 7mm,so this job may have been covered, even outside warranty limits. But my customer is rightly untrusting of the dealership now. They should have known this could have been the problem all along, and acted in good faith. Instead they've fleeced her of over £400.

I hope these symptoms might help others with the same issue. It's been a headscratcher. Not what you'd expect from a relatively young car. I'll post the final results once the job is finished.

I'm not up on the 1.5's, but I know on the older 1.6's you could buy aftermarket proper, old-fashioned solid camshafts. The downside is though, if it pops another chain, you're definitely going to need to change valves, so it's a bit hard decision to make.

What a disaster this engine is sell it while you can no amount of oil changes will save it

[james1089]

I’m guessing that making the extra oil changes helped my engine to get to 111k before self destructing.
My loan Berlingo has now done 35k (56000km)  - I’m wondering what they would say if their van suffers the same  problem at 60000km ?

Sorry to bring an old thread up, but got a Peugeot 308sw in that has the 1.5 bluehdi engine. Twin cam version late 2018.
90,000 miles on clock. 
Belt kit changed at 87,000 miles. Serviced every 10,000 miles or less. Looked after very well. Private hire vehicle. One careful lady driver. 
3 weeks after belt change, engine light came on. 2 faults stored, regarding air flow high, and low. (outside parameters) 
Initially suspected egr valve, after confirming belt timing was still 100%,and replaced with genuine part. The faults remained.
Not wanting to throw good money after bad, and conferring with other mechanics, recommended a dealer diagnostic. 
Dealers diagnosed air flow meter as a starting point, They duly changed it, and lightened my customers purse by just over £400.
2.5 miles later the light was back on. She returned to dealers, who frightened the s**t out of her by saying it needed to be put on a different diagnostic machine, and there were 17 steps to go through. Basically, they were going to throw parts at it, exactly what I was trying to avoid. Their estimate on cost was upwards of £5000 for a new engine. 
So despite the voices in my head screaming "don't touch that pile of French s**t!", I took it back on.
Here's a list of symptoms. 
Cold start rattle, like a vauxhall corsa. 
Poor turbo performance. Laggy and no top end. 
Pulsing through inlet system, like cam timing out or bent valve.
Emissions slightly higher, failed mot test. 

So, I reluctantly stripped the cam box off today. Didn't want to, but everything pointed to cam chain. After 2 hours at a snails pace, it was removed. Not really a bad job, but when you don't wanna...... 

EUREKA!!!!!! 

The cam chain tensioner is broken. No obvious major damage. Will need to do a leak down test for valve damage. The camshafts have pressed on lobes, so they are questionable. They may have spun if the valves hit the pistons. 
So it needs a minimum of a chain and tensioner kit. Maybe camshafts to be safe. Probably will be genuine parts. I haven't found any pattern ones available yet. 
It will live again! 

But here's the rub. The dealers know about this fault. There was a bulletin issued, and the service agent did mention a chain issue to my customer. It depends on the chain size, 7 or 8mm. The 7mm chain is the issue, and should be covered by peugeot. The thinnest chain links do measure up at 7mm,so this job may have been covered, even outside warranty limits. But my customer is rightly untrusting of the dealership now. They should have known this could have been the problem all along, and acted in good faith. Instead they've fleeced her of over £400.

I hope these symptoms might help others with the same issue. It's been a headscratcher. Not what you'd expect from a relatively young car. I'll post the final results once the job is finished.

I'm not up on the 1.5's, but I know on the older 1.6's you could buy aftermarket proper, old-fashioned solid camshafts. The downside is though, if it pops another chain, you're definitely going to need to change valves, so it's a bit hard decision to make.

What a disaster this engine is sell it while you can no amount of oil changes will save it

Edit turns out it was a snapped valve, chain was still okay, so not only do the chains give up but so do the valves not the only one this happened to and out of warranty. Second hand engine fitted but god only knows how long it will last.

[notsofast]

The cam chain tensioner is broken. No obvious major damage. Will need to do a leak down test for valve damage. The camshafts have pressed on lobes, so they are questionable. They may have spun if the valves hit the pistons. 
So it needs a minimum of a chain and tensioner kit. Maybe camshafts to be safe. Probably will be genuine parts. I haven't found any pattern ones available yet. 
It will live again! 

But here's the rub. The dealers know about this fault. There was a bulletin issued, and the service agent did mention a chain issue to my customer. It depends on the chain size, 7 or 8mm. The 7mm chain is the issue, and should be covered by peugeot.

I booked into a local dealer in the summer, before my warranty expired, to have a look at which size cam chain my vehicle has, and to assess whether it was showing signs of wear.  Of course they weren't able to do that without opening things up (I wasn't told this when I booked through the booking centre), and this would have been costly if nothing was looking defective, so nothing was done.  However I did have a chat with the service manager, who not only said that even well serviced vehicles were experiencing broken chains, he also said that the 8mm chain can also break. He said they usually just fitted a new engine because the plastic tensioner breaks apart when the chain breaks, and there's no knowing where all the pieces have ended up.
So it seems that the change in the recommended oil grade (see this thread: https://www.berlingoforum.com/thread-23596.html) could be the best preventative measure for this issue. Time will tell I guess.