[Brakes] Excessive brake pedal travel ???

[jj9]

Hi,

My Berlingo has a lot of pedal travel before the brakes work, the pedal is about 3/4 of the way to the floor which is a bit worrying. 
The brakes do work and stop the vehicle well if you hit them but I don't think the pedal should be so low before they work. 

I have done a bit of work to try to get the pedal better...

The servo is working as it should so no problems there. 

I removed, cleaned and greased all four callipers (discs all round) so they are all sliding nice & freely and working as they should, the pads are all free in the carriers and in good condition as are the discs. 

I removed the master cylinder and reservoir to check them over, I stripped the MC and replaced the seals even though the old seals looked fine, the MC is alloy and in good condition, the bore is nice and clean with no damage.

Fitted the MC back on the car and pressure bled the whole system with brand new fluid, so that is all fresh and clean.
(No air to report during bleeding)

With the engine off and the vacuum out of the servo if I pump the brake pedal it holds firm pressure with no real noticeable creep so the MC is holding pressure as it should.


Despite all of my efforts the pedal is still very low just like it was before I started and I don't think it should be like this.


Does anyone have any ideas as to what could be the cause of the low pedal? 



Thanks.

[Johny555]

Mines 06,2lt hdi van,,I've got a bit of travel on mine,but they work fine,are discs ,pads OK,not worn??rear shoes OK?,all my brakes are newish but still have a bit of travel on the pedal, not sure if its normal?

[jj9]

Yeah the discs are all fine, the callipers all work as they should and the piston on each one pumps out when the pedal is pressed so they are working fine.

I know all vehicles have a different feel to their brake pedal but the pedal on mine just moves too far before the brakes start to work, it couldn't have been like this from new.



Thanks.

[Johny555]

They won't be like new its 10 yes old,so must be a bit of play in it,,that's how I think any way,sounds like you have checked everything and its all OK,

[polar]

Cant see how your pedal is that low when you have done all the work you have done? You do get quite a bit of travel on the pedal but from what you are describing you do have excessive travel in the pedal that may fail an MOT.

[Kokain]

It's a Citroen thing you can't fix it. Yes I know what you mean you probably notice it more because you drive other cars, everybody who drives mine comments on how long it takes before the brakes work. On the other hand it doesn't affect the heel and toe technique, just something you need to get use to. The fix would most likely be to fit a different M/C and servo. The stuff you kinda did was pointless

[Pdamo]

Just one thought you said you power bled them and there was no air .Bit strange after all that work !I would suggest you re bleed just to make sure

[jj9]

Cant see how your pedal is that low when you have done all the work you have done?....

Me neither, the pedal was low when I got the car and despite all of my work so far it's no better.  


As I said I appreciate that different cars will have differing amounts of pedal throw but I can't see this amount being normal.

My next step is to clamp off all of the flexi hoses which will remove the callipers from the equation and see what the pedal does, if there is no improvement the problem must be with the master cylinder or the connecting rod / linkage to it.  



Thanks.

[Trevor]

I cannot see this as being normal either, my 2003 2ltr Forte which I had for over 9 years never had any problems with brake pedal travel. Does yours have the load valve on the rear axle? and if it does did you lock it off when bleeding the brakes?  I must say it sounds like air in the system to me or a very worn linkage somewhere.

[jj9]

Just one thought you said you power bled them and there was no air .Bit strange after all that work !I would suggest you re bleed just to make sure

Appreciate your thinking regarding no air...

Before removing the master cylinder I bled both front brakes so the fluid was clean and fresh, then I swung the front callipers up off the brake pads and pumped out the pistons a fair way. When the MC was refitted the pistons were pushed back which sends the fluid into the MC, that way there is no air that needs expelling.
The front brakes were then bled again along with the rears to make sure there was no air.

I cannot see this as being normal either, my 2003 2ltr Forte which I had for over 9 years never had any problems with brake pedal travel. Does yours have the load valve on the rear axle? and if it does did you lock it off when bleeding the brakes?  I must say it sounds like air in the system to me or a very worn linkage somewhere.

No my car has no load valve, it does have ABS and ESP and discs all round though.

I'm also thinking that it's trapped air and the only place it can be is in the MC, as mentioned clamping off the flexi hoses to the callipers should prove this.
The design of the MC is such that it is on an upward angle and I suppose it's possible that there is air trapped at the far ends of the primary and secondary pistons.



Thanks.